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L.A. City Council Says You Don't Have to Pay Your Red-Light Camera Tickets (and Never Did)

Categories: Traffic

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F that.
Update with clarification: "Are You Sure I Don't Have to Pay My L.A. County Red-Light Camera Ticket?"

Update: The L.A. City Council has unanimously voted to eliminate the city's red-light camera program. Tickets will cease to be issued this Sunday. (Not that you have to pay them up until then, either. Stupid.) For all y'all inquiring about other cities in L.A. County: Details at bottom of post.

Originally posted July 26 at 9:30 a.m.

The red-light camera program has turned out to be one of the biggest time- and money-wasters in the history of dysfunctional L.A. government. Not only for the citizens themselves, forking over $450 and sitting through traffic school for trying to squeak through on yellow (often the only way to move through traffic at rush hour), but for the flat-broke Los Angeles Police Department as well.

So Councilman Paul Koretz' concession at yesterday's L.A. City Council meeting was somewhat bittersweet, at least for all those who've poured their life's savings into traffic court: Koretz admitted that, if you don't pay your red-light camera ticket, the court will "send you a note saying you owe more money because you didn't pay the first time" ...

... "But they'll never actually make you pay, and they won't put it on your credit.''

In case you're still confused: Do not pay your red-light camera tickets.

If you want to know who to thank for this long-time-coming moment of clarity, we point you to an LA Weekly cover story that ran last month, after the L.A. Police Commission took a historic vote to de-endorse the program: "Jay Beeber: Folk Hero Stops L.A.'s Red Light Cameras."

Here's how Beeber, "a libertarian at heart" crusading for traffic "fairness," convinced a bunch of paranoid, debt-happy politicians that the program was moot:

Beeber says he was motivated by sheer scientific curiosity rather than anger. He hasn't had a moving violation in 20 years. But in 2009, he began to apply the scientific method he learned at the University of Michigan to the data supporting the use of red-light-camera tickets.

He estimates he spent thousands of hours, and ultimately caught LAPD making dubious claims based on iffy data. One such claim was that five fatal accidents occurred at specific intersections before the red-light cameras were installed, and none occurred after. But two of the five accidents were not red light-related, he says, and a third involved a drunken driver who zipped through despite a camera there, mounted by a previous vendor. The fourth, "caused by a young distracted driver," likely would not have been prevented by a camera.

Red-light camera advocacy groups -- namely, American Traffic Solutions, or, the company who stands to lose a $15 million camera contract with L.A. -- have done everything they can, including call the LA Weekly every other day for weeks, to convince city officials, and the public, that camera-less red lights kill.

But, like Beeber, we're not buying it.

And the part that makes us most buttsore is that up to 100,000 drivers, unaware the Superior Court had no intention of enforcing the ridiculously expensive tickets, already paid into the program, or at least had to deal with it/evade it -- which, even more ridiculously, has ended up costing the city over $1 million per year, according to City Controller Wendy Greuel.

The City Council will take a final vote on Wednesday over whether to nix the cameras, but even that could end up costing more taxpayer funds. City News Service reports that:

The City Attorney's Office told the [Budget and Finance Committee that] the city could be responsible for paying to remove the cameras and repairing the sidewalks where they were installed.

OK, before we pop our stitches, let's just leave it at this: Do not pay your red-light camera tickets. Not now. And not ever. Again.

Update: The red-light camera programs in cities outside Los Angeles have not, at this point, been terminated.

However, Paul Neuman, aide to Councilman Koretz, says red-light tickets issued in cities outside L.A. but within the county -- because they also go through the L.A. County Superior Court -- "are probably more or less in the same boat." But so far, "L.A. is the only one stating on the record that you don't have to pay."

We're calling around to individual cities, to see if they are willing to take a similar stance on the cameras, or if they have separate, harsher collections contracts in place. Check back for updates.

[@simone_electra/swilson@laweekly.com]

My Voice Nation Help
228 comments
barrazaaudrey
barrazaaudrey

Ticketed on 5/1/2013, Romona Blvd. & Francisquito Ave. (EB).  490.00 + 64.00 for traffic school.


I am unemployed and have been for 3 years.  "Do I need to pay this ticked ! "  


nervousandbroke
nervousandbroke

I just need to know if I have to pay a $490.00 camera ticket I got in Hawthorne. I can't afford that.

velen310
velen310

Hello Everyone if anyone has been in a similar situation please let me know the outcome. I had a red light ticket in 2009 I didn't receive no notice from the actual court all I received was a letter from the collection company in 2011. I had a court date I went and the judge told me to pay monthly payments of $50.00 since I am low income. The original ticket was $486.00 I made about 4 payments,  the last time I went to the courthouse I was going to make a payment like usual the clerk behind the counter told me you can no longer make payments your account has been sent to collections. I told her why if I have been making the payments she said I can't help you go and talk to the person next window which is the collection company.

I have been receiving letters from the collection company that state if I don't pay they will garnish my wages, suspend my license or will take away any property I own.

They are not charging me $286.00 they want almost $800.00 this is ridiculous because I had already made the four $50 payments which had brought the ticket to $286.00 and I have the receipt from the courthouse as proof of the balance owed.

boomer1
boomer1

EVERYONE is saying "Los Angeles CITY" What about the red light tickets (mine was making a right turn and not stopping long enough) What about LOS ANGELES COUNTY that is sending out citations for $490 on behalf of the LOS ANGELES METROPOLITION TRASPROTATION AUTHORITY TRAFFIC VIOLATION DEPT?????

 

HELP PLEASE!!!! Can someone make it clear if I have to pay the ticket and do traffic school.

 

Thank you for your time

didemos
didemos

  Re: didn't acknowledge  a red light ticket.  

 

"They cant use threats of lien of property etc without you being guilty  in court. That is an automatic $1,000 FDCPA violation. Respond with a  debt validation letter sent via certified mail. "

 

I sent GC a certified letter re: the debt validation and they sent me back a copy of  the civil assessment notice...any thoughts?  thanks!!

Ganeshr00
Ganeshr00

what about a stop sign video camera ticket. I got one for $100 from Reseda park and the ticket says it will not be noted by DMV. Do I have to pay that

Km052193
Km052193

Hi, I just got a red-light camera ticket and I'm in the city of Los Angeles, Van Nuys.  The ticket was for passing a busway red-light. Do I have to pay that ticket, please respond ?

Da1luv2006
Da1luv2006

I got one these red light camera tickets in the mail but I'm confused because the light was yellow while I was crossing and my car is under my stepdads name...I pay the car monthly though..I'm hearing u don't have to pay 480 but I don't want it to have consequences..now he Wants to put the ticket under my name.I'm currently broke n don't know what to do...help!!!

guest
guest

got a letter threatening to garnish ages, attach to my bank account of filing a lien on my property?  Can they do that? 

Steve Frank
Steve Frank

Using threats like that is a FDCPA violation, which you can take them to court for $1,000 per incident violation.

You need to respond to any and all letters with a FDCPA Debt Validation Letter. Do not give them any more information on you than what's on their paper.

In the letter make sure to write that all communication should be in writing and writing only and that you dispute the alleged debt without proper validation.

Give them notice that using threats is a possible violation of FDCPA law and that you retain all rights to sue them for such violations.

Read about FDCPA and about debt validation letters. Also visit budhibbs dot com and learn at the forums.

karen
karen

what about inglewood? And it shows me going thru a YELLOW light NOT red! wtf!

Anarkis_boyz
Anarkis_boyz

i got this ticket 2 weeks ago in culver city, and i have 2 weeks left to respond to this ticket. So far, my research told me that call for extension was not a good idea. Ignoring this will cause me wont be able to re new my Driver lisence and car registration in the future.. So i think the only way is : to take a deep breath, pay the fine, go to traffic school + move on...T_T

Steve Frank
Steve Frank like.author.displayName 1 Like

You must work for ATS. Only idiots pay these fines.

Anarkis_boyz
Anarkis_boyz

so i ignore it? is it gonna be alright? they said that i won't be able to renew my registration and my driver lisence if i dont pay the fees.. is it any other solution steve? i mean, i have been asking people around and nobody know what's going on..and you are the one that sound very sure about what to do..

Steve Frank
Steve Frank

Fight it via FDCPA law with the collection agencies. Who told you they wont renew your registration or Drivers license? These are not enforable. Just make sure you respond to all collection letters with a FDCPA debt validation request. For more info budhibbs.com

Guest
Guest

What happened to Steve Frank who was telling everyone not to pay their tickets?  I don't see any follow up from anyone who said they would be ignoring their  tickets.  Did everyone fall off the face of the earth, or just not respond with their outcome?  My husband is dead set against paying his recent ticket from Commerce CA, but he is basing his decision on things he is reading via the web that is dated nearly a year ago.  Incidentally, the tickets are now $480.  So, is there anyone form 8 months ago who ignored their ticket and are still standing?

Steve Frank
Steve Frank

If you haven't answered to a judge or court, it's best to ignore them as they are not enforceable, they will scare you with collection letters, but read about FDCPA laws, answer each time they send you a collection letter with a debt validation letter, every time. Challenge it with your credit report if they hit your credit report. The fine for the most part is not enforceable. If you entered a plea inside a court room you have to honor what you said in there. Otherwise these should not be taken into court and plead guilty. Contact a lawyer for better info. This is just an opinion.

Guest
Guest

thanks for the response, Steve.  In the end, my husband is the one who will make the decision for himself - he is leaning towards your opinion.  My concern is that we are planning on buying a home soon, and I'd rather not have this hanging 'out there' while we go for the loan.  At this point, he has done nothing, so his options are still wide open.  Thanks again.

Anarkis_boyz
Anarkis_boyz

hi there.. so what did your husband do? did he pay the fee?or did he ignored it?please let me know.. i have to respond to the letter in 2 weeks..thank you

Steve Frank
Steve Frank

Any banker or loan will understand if it hits your credit report, why you disputed this. The main thing is to write a FDCPA letter to each collection letter and tell them in the langugue that not to hit your credit report or put that you are disputing the validity of the collection. That way your credit report is not hit with a mark. Go to budhibbs.com

allen
allen

Got a red light ticket for making a right, i'm sure they will argue it was a "rolling right".  Also there was no "NO RIGHT on RED" signs. 

I got a ticket through the mail..i postponed the court date so obviously i didnt see a judge yet and i didn't plea guilty or not guilty.  Am I in a position to just ignore it and have it goto collections as so many of you has suggested?Will it affect my credit?Thanks!

Anarkis_boyz
Anarkis_boyz

how was the ticket go so far??please let me know...

65spirit
65spirit

I got a red light camera ticket, in Lynwood CA, is that included in the do not pay list

Erik
Erik

how about the city of covina or if the ticket went to GI services a collection agency for the courts will it get removed

help
help

Hi Simone,

Thank you for your articles, "L.A. City Council Says You Don't Have to Pay Your Red-Light Camera Tickets (and Never Did)" and "Clarification: Are You Sure I Don't Have to Pay My L.A. County Red-Light Camera Ticket?" I'm sure you've gotten a million emails like this, but I got a red light camera ticket on March 2nd at the intersection of Jefferson and Duquesne in Culver City (the ticket says City/County of Occurrence: Culver City/Los Angeles) for making a right turn without stopping (it was yellow when I pulled up!). Anyway, I want to trust your article and not pay the ticket, but I'm scared of affecting my credit score or driving record (the ticket says a point will go on my record). So, I wanted to write you a message and see if you had any new info on this or if something about my particular situation would keep me from being someone who doesn't need to pay. Have you heard from anyone for whom this worked successfully? Or more importantly, unsuccessfully? I know you must be very busy, but if you could please get back to me as soon as possible, I would really appreciate it, as I am supposed to visit the court to set a court date and pay my $480 "bail" before the end of next week. (4/6/12)Thank you

erwin
erwin

hi bro..how is it?? did you ignore the ticket or you pay the fine? i have 2 weeks left to respond to this ticket..please share with me.thank you

help
help

 I've ignored my ticket and I don't want to jinx it, but so far have heard nothing (i believe i was supposed to respond by the beginning of April). I sent a question to the author of this article, Simone, when I was trying to decide what to do and she responded with this:

http://blogs.laweekly.com/info...

It looks like there is a lot of evidence supporting ignoring the ticket.

I've kept these comments forwarding to my email and read them every so often. I've seen a few people saying they've postponed their court date and now want to ignore it. As far as my understanding goes, if you've postponed your court date, or have responded in any way, it's too late for you to start ignoring it and you need to pay the ticket/go to court. If you haven't though, I say ignore.

When I was deciding what to do, I was frustrated that I hadn't seen many people commenting who had ignored and had successful results, so I intend to keep you guys updated. I will comment again if I hear anything or get any letters...but so far so good!

-J

j23lord
j23lord

hi there,

 

 I was wondering if you heard anything back from them, or some collections... any suspend on driver license? 

 

thanks 

Guest
Guest

Recently got a red light camera ticket from the city of Baldwin Park (part of Los Angeles county). the car was not mine but my brother. he took my information and send it in. I just wanted to know if i still have paid for the ticket? Or can i just ignore the ticket? thanks 

Dianne
Dianne

I got a ticket on July 6, 2011. I never paid my ticket because I heard we didn't have to. But now the fine has doubled. What is the official ruling on this? 

Guest
Guest

yes I want to know what is the ruling?

Guest
Guest

Do I have to pay for a traffic camera ticket I received in West Hollywood?

Barrun
Barrun

Got a red light camera ticket in the mail today. Happened in West Hollywood (La Brea and Santa Monica Blvd). What's the current sitiuation for West Hollywood? What happens if I do not pay the $479?

Robres
Robres

My daughter just got a failure to appear notice for what we figured out was from running a red light in Covina.  No first notice was ever sent.  How do I get that picture?

tanya
tanya

i recieved a photo red light ticket in pasadena last week for running a red light. do i have to pay it or can i just throw it away

Sean
Sean

Jan 21, 2012...

Received a red light camera ticket for right on red in Walnut. 

Also, does watching the video validate that you received the letter?  I'm planning on ignoring this...

MRW
MRW

I got an LA Metropolitan Transportation authority camera traffic ticket- failure to stop at the red signal, on Sepulveda NB @busway. The courthouse is the Van Nuys courthouse. Do I need to pay the $480 fee?

Kcollins9499
Kcollins9499

I received a red light ticket in May of last year it has now gone to a collection agency if I don't pay them will they suspend my license?/

Loveumari_1@yahoo.com
Loveumari_1@yahoo.com

I received a red light camera ticket in Gardena, CA, approximately one month ago, do I have to pay it?

Sasmith0208
Sasmith0208

Jan 2012Valencia. Tickets still being issued.

smartmouth1
smartmouth1

I got a red light ticket in glendale, but i put it through and have a court date on may. I really don't have 500 bucks to pay, but my question is this. I'm trying to go for the lapd, so is it best to go to court and plead not guilty? ( i saw the video, and it shows my car turning left at the yellow light but turns red immediately after) HELP!!!

Lorrie420
Lorrie420

I received a red light camera ticket in Bellflower.   Do I have to pay this

Barbara
Barbara

I got a red light ticket making a right turn in Cerritos.  South street on to Gridley.  I made a complete stop - checked for traffic and turned right, camera went off.  Should I ignore or go to court?  I am not paying it - I truly made a complete stop and then turned!!!!

guest
guest

I just received a ticket on south st to studebaker. I made a stop , signaled then turned and still got a ticket. I was planning on fighting the ticket. After reading that people are still losing even with all the evidence supporting my innocence, I'm not sure on what the best approach would be. I really don't want a warrant out for my arrest especially since I'm going to take my sheriff entrance exam next month. Any feed back would be appreciated.

Godiegogo81
Godiegogo81

I got a ticket on stud baker also and Soth St I also made a complete stop and got the ticket...whats up with this,I'm a commercial driver and I depend on my licence can't take a chanse not to paid...what should I do?

Tracey
Tracey

I just got a red light ticket from Moreno Valley Courthouse, The camera was in Corona - They want $ 508.00 for the ticket - That is crazy - This is part of Riverside Cty - Do I have to pay this ticket?

Numic
Numic

Has anyone used the "Ticket Kick" .com service of writing for a "trial by declaration" to have a red light camera ticket dropped?

Slyannette714
Slyannette714

Recieved a red light camara ticket from Highland Police Depart. and asked to appear at San Bernadino District Superior Court, are they under the do not pay red light camara ticket is this part of La county

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